"No to agreements over Kyiv's head. Salvini against the EU? Just rhetoric." Perego speaks.

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"After more than three years of conflict in Ukraine, I am convinced that it is necessary to take any action that leads to a ceasefire and negotiations between the parties as soon as possible . However, this does not mean accepting dangerous shortcuts." Matteo Perego di Cremnago, Undersecretary of Defense for Forza Italia , explains the government's cautious stance, alongside Europe, on the August meeting in Alaska between Donald Trump and Vladimir Putin. Perego says: "We are watching the August meeting carefully and hoping it can open new avenues, but also with the awareness that it could also lead to unsatisfactory or partial agreements."

Meanwhile, Europe and Ukraine will not be present at the meeting. Giorgia Meloni, along with other European leaders and Ukrainian President Zelensky, will speak with Trump before the meeting. What will they say? "The message," says the undersecretary, "will be clear and unified: Europe strongly supports Ukraine's right to defend its sovereignty and territorial integrity. It will be crucial to seek solutions built together with Kyiv, not over its head. Furthermore, European leaders will ask to work on a realistic path to a ceasefire and the start of negotiations based on international law and mutual security guarantees, avoiding hasty agreements that could turn into precarious truces."

But will they be listened to? A member of your government, Deputy Prime Minister Matteo Salvini of the Northern League, says that the EU could at most bring water to that summit . In other words: Europe is irrelevant. Not an insignificant statement, don't you think? "We," replies the Undersecretary, "actually hope that Europe will embark on a path that will lead it to play a credible role on the international stage. Beyond the politically nuanced rhetoric, it is our duty to continue working to ensure that Europe's presence is not that of a 'simple water carrier,' but that of a protagonist capable of influencing the outcome of a negotiation." And what if an agreement were to be reached over the heads of Kyiv and the Union? After Witkoff's visit to Russia, there is talk of a territorial swap, and everyone in Ukraine is very worried, fearing a trap with Trump's approval. "Any agreement that fails to take into account Ukraine's wishes and interests would risk not only undermining its sovereignty, but also setting a dangerous precedent for the global order and the validity of international law," Perego responds. "Any solution should be the result of inclusive negotiations, not imposed from outside. From the earliest stages of the conflict, we have supported Ukraine's defense capacity, under attack from the Russian Federation. Our goal must remain to foster a sustainable peace process that provides long-term security and does not create future instability. For this reason, we will continue to work with other member states and allies to ensure that Ukraine remains an active participant in any negotiations and that its rights are not challenged."

Without a just peace, there's a risk that, after a few years, Russia will directly attack European states, testing the effectiveness of the NATO treaty. This is a scenario feared by EU intelligence services and various think tanks. What are your thoughts? "I think it's crucial to learn all the lessons of history, past—the Budapest Agreement, Minsk I and Minsk II—and present, and to act realistically and foresightedly in the face of these lessons. Deterrence only works if accompanied by political cohesion, credible military capabilities, strategic stockpiles, and a consistent commitment to upholding international law. It's time for Europe to change course and finally become a major player in international geopolitics within the broader transatlantic alliance landscape."

Meanwhile, the rearmament plan continues. Italy has decided to access the €15 billion Safe Fund for defense investments. This change of stance was also advocated for months ago. Are you satisfied? " It's crucial to understand that defense and security are two sides of the same coin; without these prerequisites, there can be no growth, development, or welfare. This is why I'm pleased with the concrete actions aimed at strengthening our industrial and technological capabilities in this crucial sector. We're talking about employment, innovation, and national strategic supply chains, as well as investments with a direct impact on collective security in the face of new scenarios, such as cyber, space, and underwater. These are opportunities we couldn't afford to miss, and now the challenge will be to quickly translate them into concrete, synergistic projects with our European partners, thus maximizing the return on every euro invested."

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